1,2 TDI clutch/ gearbox problems

Hi RAB,

Looks like I've found why gears where not activated:
20160711_203404 (1).jpg
It's 4th ( bottom one ) valve connector. I did not noticed that it was damaged, as it's quite dark inside engine section :)

So I've removed all wiring outside and checked all wires for damage. 3rd connector also has some insulation damaged. Decided to change them to new ones ( code 1j0973722 ).

Will keep you in touch guys, maybe someone will face same issues.
 
UPDATE and SOLVED

Changed those connectors, still got RTFM12 error. Removed gear actuator again for inspection and saw, that bottom gear selector is even more loosen that it was before. Selector's tightening screw was screwed to the max, and there is still some space to wobble. So I took off some aluminium to increase space and refitted screw.

selector.jpg

No play on selector and axis. Re-fitted it all back together

bottom selector.jpg

And Hallelujah, basic settings went from the first try. Thanks RAB on guiding me, now gear actuator doesn't seems to be very complicated part :D
 
Hello,
Having problems with my A2 again. It happened some days ago. While slowing down 5th gear disenaged, when I tried to accelerat engine rewed up and turned off. Was not able to start it again. There was obvious oil leak by the look of engine bay. Towed car to home, refilled oil, deleted 2 error codes and was able to start engine again, but only in N position. Got no reaction in S position. Gear actuators lower hose had a hole, lost oil in 20-30 seconds and engine stopped again. Replaced both hoses, but problems only started. VCDS showed no errors. Filled up oil. At first pump was making strange noises, but it went to normal soon and turned off. I disconected it released pressure from acumulator and refilled oil. Repeated this step again, oil level was normal. Im still not sure if there is still air inside system. This time was not able to start. Tipronic didnt shift gears. Gearbox was in neutral, I tried to turn ignition on in N position, it didnt help. Basic setting ended in RTFM 12 several times. Never saw actuator working, it made only clicking noises. Another strange thing is clutch showing 1,1-1,2V. Did basic setting ~10kkm ago clutch was something like 1,9V. Any ideas, what could be wrong?
 
When the basic setting is done, do you adjust the gear actuator? If not, this might cause RTFM 12. This involves removing the undertray, loosening the linkage and re-tightening it. System is self-bleeding. Do complete basic setting, including clutch adjustment and actuator linkage. Also check that the rod with ball joints at each end on the gear actuator is in good order.

RAB
 
Clutch is adjusted and linkage was changed ~10kkm ago. At first I tried basic setting 2 times without adjusting linkage, since car worked fine before oil leak. Then I tryed doing basic setting with different linkage possitions. In all cases VCDS counted 2 times to 28 and ended with RTFM 12. Not a single gear change was made during basic setting. Actuator made only clicking noises, I saw no movements. Problem must be somewhere else.
 
But if the clutch is only showing 1.2V, the clutch cable needs adjusting but the fact that it has changed so much in such a short time suggests that you might have a clutch problem (or a clutch actuator problem). Are the two hydraulic connections to the actuator connected correctly and not crossed over? There is only one correct position for the linkage, that is to loosen it and then re-tighten. Never miss out any part of the basic setting, particularly the linkage adjustment.

RAB
 
You should check does difference between engaged and disengaged clutch in 4th window in 014 block of VCDS is larger than 2V ( in your case you should get at least 3.2V if normally you have 1.2V ( manual says it should be 1.8-2.0V ).
Also you can try to engage gear manually by disconnecting gear actuator bottom gear selector rod from the gearbox and shifting by hand. Also you could try to do basic settings in same situation.
 
My previous answer didnt post, so I have to write again...
RAB
I already adjusted clutch, cable was loose, moved easily up and down abbout 2cm. Is there an easy way to check clutch actuator? During basic setting it didnt move.
Linkage fell to lowest position, before it was in the middle. Ihad to adjust the part it was attached to. Later I started to experiment with different positions.
I installed pipes like shown here:
http://www.realoem.me/Audi/RDW/A2/2002/248/R/1/142/142030
ceonke
About clutch I dont know. Have to look at it later. Right now its not working.
I didnt understand, what you mean. Is the basic setting doable without working actuator, by moving gear box by hand?
 
The cable is always under tension, it should never be loose so it looks like a defective clutch. Also that much wear (1.9v to 1.2v) in 10,000km is impossible, so voltage is just reflecting lack of tension in the cable. No point in doing a basic setting. The clutch won't work anyway if you cannot do a good basic setting, so the clutch actuator may be OK. Do you have the rubber cover (for inspection) at the top of the clutch housing? If not, water may have got in and the clutch has seized.

RAB
 
Thanks for ideas. If I remember correctly, mine had a cover, will take a look at it today or tomorrow.
 
Ruby said:
My previous answer didnt post, so I have to write again...
RAB
I already adjusted clutch, cable was loose, moved easily up and down abbout 2cm. Is there an easy way to check clutch actuator? During basic setting it didnt move.
Linkage fell to lowest position, before it was in the middle. Ihad to adjust the part it was attached to. Later I started to experiment with different positions.
I installed pipes like shown here:
http://www.realoem.me/Audi/RDW/A2/2002/248/R/1/142/142030
ceonke
About clutch I dont know. Have to look at it later. Right now its not working.
I didnt understand, what you mean. Is the basic setting doable without working actuator, by moving gear box by hand?
Click to expand...

Looks like there is no hydraulic pressure in the system. Does hydraulic control unit is starting when you're opening the drivers door/turning inginiot on?

There is the way to measure clutch disk

209541_01_Fotor.jpg

Measure this distance ( see picture ).

If it's lower that 7.7 cm, clutch disk should be changed
FYI: Diameter of new disk: 8,6mm
Diameter of worn disk which needs to be changed: 7.4
These measurement's are not strict, but helpful.
 
I suspect that it is not clutch wear that is the problem. Either the clutch has seized or there are problems with the release bearing or guide sleeve.

RAB
 
Today I looked under that rubber cover. My buddy has this small diagnostic camera. We put it inside, there was no obvious damage. Distance between those 2 holes is 81mm.
I think problem could be in oil pump. I disconnected lowest pipe from actuator, while running basic setting. As I understand there must be pressure as long as there is pressure in accumulator. There was only few drops. Pump turns on like it should, sounds the same as before. Oil level falls down, when it starts running. After removing accumulator oil appear again. Maybe pump is half dead, it runs, but cant build up pressure big enough to run through valve after accumulator. Or maybe valve is stuck. Removed pump assembly and turned it on, oil was not coming out of it.
 
That doesn't explain why the cable is slack. It should always be taut; when the clutch is closed, the cable is kept taut by the clutch springing and when open by the actuator. If the cable is slack, it means that the clutch is open, but why so, when as you say there is no hydraulic pressure?

Also check the hydraulic oil quality. If your car is an A2, the drain for the scuttle is near the reservoir. If the drain blocked, water can enter the reservoir as the level falls and air (or water) is sucked in through the breather hole in the green cap. If so, you may have 'sludge' in your system rather than oil!

RAB
 
If there is liquid drop during pump operation, electric pump is functional. Liquid under pressure goes into accumulator. I think problem could be in solenoid valve, as this is main and only part which can block hyd. liquid flowing into pipes system.

Check the cable between solenoid valve and connector, check connector itself.
2016-08-22 17_Fotor2.jpg
As i understood this valve operates at 12V, so you can try activating it by external power source ( but only with disconnected main hyd. unit jack ).

Slack clutch cable is another problem, but I assume no pressure in the system is in prior on that.
 
ceonke said:
Slack clutch cable is another problem, but I assume no pressure in the system is in prior on that.
Click to expand...

The clutch cable, in normal operation, should never be slack. Without any pressure, the clutch should be closed and the cable taut. There is a spring in the actuator that helps keep the cable taut, to prevent it dis-engaging from the clutch arm but is weaker than the clutch springing. With pressure, the clutch will open, the actuator acting against the clutch springs and with its own spring. If the clutch cable is slack, it can only mean that the clutch is seized in the open position.

RAB
 
RAB said:
The clutch cable, in normal operation, should never be slack. Without any pressure, the clutch should be closed and the cable taut. There is a spring in the actuator that helps keep the cable taut, to prevent it dis-engaging from the clutch arm but is weaker than the clutch springing. With pressure, the clutch will open, the actuator acting against the clutch springs and with its own spring. If the clutch cable is slack, it can only mean that the clutch is seized in the open position.

RAB
Click to expand...

Yes RAB, I totally agree with you. What I tried to say, maybe it's worth to deal with "no-pressure" problem, and look out the clutch. Sorry for not being clear enough.
 
Ruby said:
I think problem could be in oil pump. I disconnected lowest pipe from actuator, while running basic setting. As I understand there must be pressure as long as there is pressure in accumulator. There was only few drops.
Click to expand...

One hose to the gear actuator is a pressure line, the other a return (no pressure). The pressure line is under high pressure (or should be), so disconnecting while live is dangerous. The clutch actuator has only a single line because the switching solenoid is mounted on the hydraulic station and so the single hose can act as a pressure line and return.

RAB
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Solved the problem. It was the solenoid valve. I dissasembled pump completely and cleaned. There was not much to clean thogh. But it helped. After assembly actuator started to work imediately, it shifted aimlesly. Clutch was nearly 3V. Adjusted ewerything and did basic setting all 3 steps on first attempt.
Thank you guys.
 
Hello,
There is a Lupo 3l. The basic settings ends with RTFM 12. The pressure accumulator is new, the complete clutch with guide sleeve is about 1 year old. When it was changed all worked well when I did the basic settings, but now the bottom part of the "gangsteller" was changed (there was a crack there so it was leaking) and after the basic setting it stop with RTFM12. We tried the front wheels in the air, tried to help the robot after the first 28 cycle to find neutral. The reverse light is ok. Now to be honest I have run out of ideas.
Do you have any other?

Thanks
Dan
 
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