Electric conversion project

[4markowen]

Less of the FUD about Cobalt please. It goes into petrol to desulphurise it and then gets burnt. At least in a battery it's recyclable and/or has a longer life than being burnt to stop acid rain. Which shows if the chemistry of fuel can be improved so can battery chemistry.

The ideal option is less cars. But decades upon decades of building car focused business parks (including the 90s when they built them with too few parking space and fanciful public transport options), housing estates without amenities in walking distance and same poor public transport options or cycling infrastructure and the worst of all IMO, the retail park and superstore.

I posted in the other Thread about a couple of recent A2 projects that have got some work going on Johannes is progressing well and will be done cheaply using a Prius transaxle and inverter and leaf battery pack. He's already done a Touran with identical Canbus messages. Using OEM parts from hybrids keeps the costs down and thanks to plug in hybrids there's quite a bit of choice coming down the road for cheap parts.

I'm still in the getting bits together to mess about on the bench testing phase. A gen3 Toyota inverter and Lexus rear electric powered diff. But think a Mini Countryman BMS Series 2 rear diff would be ideal size and power, mainly as the Lexus diff is a bit limited by design (drops off after 30-40mph)

The A2 has some nice spaces for batteries though. But it's maximising space, some doodles I've done put CALB style modules ahead of Tesla modules as you make better use of the space where the fuel tank is and behind the rear subframe. Then you get into sufficient batteries and voltages to power your inverter and motor combination effectively. I'll likely start with a BMW hybrid battery pack with about 12kWh as the A2 will be for pooling about and getting it all to work. Then drop £8k on all the CALB modules and c. 60kWh worth and the range from that.

Then there's the weight changes of what you save or add in and where you put it. The 12v system. and so on.

Or there's the whole DC based system or new motor and controller parts route. 2nd OEM keeps the costs way down and is upcycling so greener.

It's a fun project with the risk of death at certain points. Can't see why more people aren't interested in it tbh

 

[Guest 4123]

Less of the FUD about Cobalt please. It goes into petrol to desulphurise it and then gets burnt. At least in a battery it's recyclable and/or has a longer life than being burnt to stop acid rain. Which shows if the chemistry of fuel can be improved so can battery chemistry.

Cobalt is used as a catalyst in desulphurisation; it's not an ingredient.

RAB

 

[Chewy0013]

A YouTube channel called Rich Rebuilds (very enjoyable content) did an EV conversion on the cheaper side (new shape mini).

It was a 7 part series walking through the whole process.

If you're happy to use it for short distances, have the experience / space / tools and don't mind the limitations, I think it is very doable.

 

[4markowen]

Cobalt is used as a catalyst in desulphurisation; it's not an ingredient.

RAB

But it is used. My point was more not to throw allegations of child labour around when you're in the same glass house using it

All these raw materials required and the pearl clutching over digging them up, but no similar concern about tar sands, fracking, marine environments and the endless spills there, pipelines through the wilderness that leak.

 

[DJ 190]

I have the perfect donor vehicle. It's truly immaculate

The mileage is high and I'm struggling to sort out the gearbox. It's off the road. I'll provide this car to anyone who would like to use it for an electric conversion. I'll provide complete financial support, too. Depending on distance, I'd also contribute my time and expertise. I have excellent garage facilities at my property which could be used for the project, if that was considered as a suitable option. I would imagine that this could turn out to be a highly successful route to electrifying A2's. It could provide a blueprint for any owner to travel the same route. What is to be done after (say) my A2 has been converted? I would consider its sale to the person who had converted it for a very fair amount or I would own it and generously reimburse that same person for their (considerable) efforts. I have other ways of showing my appreciation, too .... My current vehicle is using fuel which cost 31.5 p.p.l. It returns 37 - 39 m.p.g. Diesel cost over 180 p.p.l. (and it's not stopping there!) Well, that equates to my car going 217 miles for the equivalent cost of a gallon of diesel fuel. ( I must add that that the same fuel would now cost 49 p.p.l. ) I'm not sure what an electric car would cost to run? We'd be looking at a charging cost better than £3.77 per 100 miles ....

David

 

[andrewparkeruk]

I cannot see that conversion of a vehicle based in ICE to a full electric makes any sense. It does make for an interesting read, but if I was to want an electric vehicle, I would want one designed from the ground up around that technology

I am disappointed, even by Teslas, about how hamstrung they appear by being successors to “cars”

 

[Sylvester]

I have the perfect donor vehicle. It's truly immaculate

View attachment 92490

The mileage is high and I'm struggling to sort out the gearbox. It's off the road. I'll provide this car to anyone who would like to use it for an electric conversion. I'll provide complete financial support, too. Depending on distance, I'd also contribute my time and expertise. I have excellent garage facilities at my property which could be used for the project, if that was considered as a suitable option. I would imagine that this could turn out to be a highly successful route to electrifying A2's. It could provide a blueprint for any owner to travel the same route. What is to be done after (say) my A2 has been converted? I would consider its sale to the person who had converted it for a very fair amount or I would own it and generously reimburse that same person for their (considerable) efforts. I have other ways of showing my appreciation, too .... My current vehicle is using fuel which cost 31.5 p.p.l. It returns 37 - 39 m.p.g. Diesel cost over 180 p.p.l. (and it's not stopping there!) Well, that equates to my car going 217 miles for the equivalent cost of a gallon of diesel fuel. ( I must add that that the same fuel would now cost 49 p.p.l. ) I'm not sure what an electric car would cost to run? We'd be looking at a charging cost better than £3.77 per 100 miles ....

David

This would be a great project, but as it would be a one-off, and nobody has done it before, I can see this would end up costing £15-20k easily and probably would take years to complete as well.
There are a few garages in the UK actually specialise turning fuel cars to ev, but they charge £30k+.

 

[DJ 190]

Yes, there's a new kid on the block

The Dacia Spring and at an astonishingly low price! The idea with converting an A2 is that it could be done for a realistically low cost ( I.M.H.O.) I would say well below the typical price range for these cars (£25-35,000) There are several A2's that have already been converted to electric and I was on my way to meet an owner in The Netherlands a couple of Year's ago .... A Nissan Leaf would be a suitable donor and I've seen a few for sale at very reasonable prices. I've always had a high level of confidence in what I do and I'm never negative and a "messenger of doom" The A2 has a lot going for it .... lightweight aluminium body, light and airy interior (with the glass roof) and its quirky design. I wonder if the shocks and suspension could cope with the extra battery weight, though? I feel that the A2 could make a very special conversion to electric power and a project to achieve this could benefit from the (maybe considerable) input from members of this club. My feeling is that a figure of sub £10,000 is feasible to do this ....

David

 

[tomh]

Hello guys.
Have a 1.4 tdi 2001. Wanted to convert to eV. Do you know what parts should I get and where can I get them?


Sent from my MAR-LX1M using Tapatalk

Dont be blasfemick to the TDI and destroy an A2 whit making a almost perfect car useless. If you want an electric car buye a BMW I3 then, And sell the A2 to someone that understand what good car the tdi is.

 

[A2Dreamer]

There's a good article here around batteries and battery technology.

Electric cars and batteries: how will the world produce enough?

Reducing the use of scarce metals — and recycling them — will be key to the world’s transition to electric vehicles.

www.nature.com

In the meantime, as to what's the alternative solution @RAB , if I had the,answer to that I'd be doing really well. I just have in mind that, not so very long ago, we were being pushed down the route of diesel; that's not ended well and I fear that this won't either. Our generation capacity is currently insufficient, not clean enough and the grid infrastructure creaking, I can't imagine that it's capable of supporting a society full of huge numbers of electric vehicles, plus all the air source heat pumps for domestic and commercial heating that are also being pushed. Heat pumps, when applied correctly, can provide very good carbon savings.

Our population (nationally and globally) is expanding at an alarming rate, putting intolerable pressure on finite resources, we have a miserable and expensive public transport system, everyone wants personal transport and wants that transport to be the latest wizz bang technology.

I flew Luton to Edinburgh recently for £80 return, the train would have been £212! Similarly, we were planning to get my lad down from Preston to Newquay in the summer; £420 by train and £70 by easyjet from Manchester... Seriously??

The public transport system should be so good, so cheap and so easy, that you'd be bonkers to even consider driving.

Most journeys I do, I can do in my old td5 Discovery for less than half the cost (in fuel) of taking the train (though probably not now with the current surge in fuel prices). That should simply not be possible.

Just in case anyone is wondering, my line of work is is in industrial and commercial energy efficiency. We're involved with power generation in combined heat and power (gas) engines, heat pumps of most flavours, steam and hot water boilers, heat recovery, District heating networks,
Optimisation of existing systems etc.

I firmly believe in sustainability through longevity, and that our forum here, with the ethos of the folks within, is a shining beacon of that sustainability.

?

 

[Guest 4123]

I firmly believe in sustainability through longevity, and that our forum here, with the ethos of the folks within, is a shining beacon of that sustainability.

?

Your post suggests that you are blissfully unaware of the urgency of decarbonisation. Even now, a majority in the government are against on-shore wind generation. Not surprising really, given that these are the same people that gave us the idiocy of Brexit.

RAB

 

[Ami]

Your post suggests that you are blissfully unaware of the urgency of decarbonisation. Even now, a majority in the government are against on-shore wind generation. Not surprising really, given that these are the same people that gave us the idiocy of Brexit.

RAB

The best words I have heard in a very very long time @RAB .
Cheers for that
Ami

 

[A2Dreamer]

Your post suggests that you are blissfully unaware of the urgency of decarbonisation.

I wholeheartedly agree with you on the idiocy of Brexit...

Not really sure how this is your takeaway from my post though - I'm actively and heavily involved in reducing carbon emissions and environmental impact of our activities on the planet, both on a personal and professional level.

 

[Guest 4123]

Not really sure how this is your takeaway from my post though - I'm actively and heavily involved in reducing carbon emissions and environmental impact of our activities on the planet, both on a personal and professional level.

I would suggest that "sustainability through longevity" and urgent decarbonisation are not very compatible. As far as the climate is concerned, once we pass the point of no return, all bets are off. The problem is that no one knows where that point is. We will have to give up fossil fuels anyway; the sooner the better.

RAB

 

[2work]

Afternoon all,

A topic which is obviously close to all our hearts both personally and professionally. This thread started with great motives showing what might be possible in time converting our fossil fuel vehicles.

Let’s play nicely and try to keep the thread on track whilst not allowing it to land in a political debate where the original intension of the OP is lost. There is scope for this thread to be locked should it continue to stray from its intended purpose.

Kind regards,

Tom

 

[Andrew]

Back to Transition One. I fear the A2 will never be a model for which they would develop their drop in kit, just simply not enough global numbers to warrant their development. My question is how close is the A2 to a Polo to use a Polo kit?

Andy

 

[Skipton01]

The issue with using anything designed for a Polo is that you'd need custom brackets as the A2 chassis (space frame) is completely bespoke and although it takes a Polo engine/gearbox, the mounts for these components are unique to the A2. Same is true of any battery pack which bolts to any body structure. It won't work without custom mounts.

 

[audi Atwo]

Not sure if this is any help but come across this today on you tube they converted a fiat 500 in to an ev price was not to bad either

Hope its helpful

J

 

[Rusty911]

I have the perfect donor vehicle. It's truly immaculate

View attachment 92490

The mileage is high and I'm struggling to sort out the gearbox. It's off the road. I'll provide this car to anyone who would like to use it for an electric conversion. I'll provide complete financial support, too. Depending on distance, I'd also contribute my time and expertise. I have excellent garage facilities at my property which could be used for the project, if that was considered as a suitable option. I would imagine that this could turn out to be a highly successful route to electrifying A2's. It could provide a blueprint for any owner to travel the same route. What is to be done after (say) my A2 has been converted? I would consider its sale to the person who had converted it for a very fair amount or I would own it and generously reimburse that same person for their (considerable) efforts. I have other ways of showing my appreciation, too .... My current vehicle is using fuel which cost 31.5 p.p.l. It returns 37 - 39 m.p.g. Diesel cost over 180 p.p.l. (and it's not stopping there!) Well, that equates to my car going 217 miles for the equivalent cost of a gallon of diesel fuel. ( I must add that that the same fuel would now cost 49 p.p.l. ) I'm not sure what an electric car would cost to run? We'd be looking at a charging cost better than £3.77 per 100 miles ....

David

'My current vehicle is using fuel which cost 31.5 p.p.l. It returns 37 - 39 m.p.g.'

Now come on, you can't just let that just hang there. Vegetable oil?

 

[DJ 190]

It's LPG. The next delivery is 54 p.p.l. and that's a bargain! That's because in early April a government fuel "cap" is coming off and that will take it to 75-85 p.p.l. ! It's applicable to all fuels .... heating oil, gas, L.P.G. and electricity. I've seen diesel at 189 p.p.l. and I'm told it has exceeded £2 a litre in some places. I've got an antique "Shell" petrol pump outside my property. It's marked with the cost of petrol (then). It's 1 shilling and six and a half pence, a gallon! So that's not even 2 p.p.l.! I actually remember paying that price when I owned my first car (a Ford Corsair) in 1966! It had a bench front seat and column change! I'd so like to purchase one, now! Oh, we won the World Cup, too! I glance at my gorgeous A2 here, quite often. I'm not sure when I might use it again ...... Maybe when diesel fuel is back down around 120 -130 p.p.l. ? Will I live that long?

David