Engine Mounts

timmus

timmus

A2OC Donor
Hi Guys and Gals,

I've decided my engine mounts have reached the end of their life and need replacing. However, before I order to bits from Audi, I've got a few questions for those with some knowledge in this area...

It seems the off-side, upper engine mount for the TDI came in two designs:
8Z0 199 212 C (with protective cap) - for the AMF engine
8Z0 199 212 J (without protective cap) - for the ATL and BHC engines

I understand that the mount was redesigned due to the MAF sensor housing rattling against the protective cap.
I have the AMF engine and my current mount has the bulky cap on top. Should I replace it like-for-like, or is the redesign a generally superior item?
Does anyone know are the two mounts totally interchangeable?

Thanks folks!

Tom
 
Thanks Sojah.

I'd read that thread (I can read German) and it doesn't answer this question. In fact, it was where some of the information I've posted above came from.

Bret, if you're reading this, perhaps you know a little more. Are the two types interchangeable, and is one recommended over the other?

Cheers,

Tom
 
Hi Tom

I've just had a look at the two mounts.
. The AMF (212C) version is about £190 and the ATL/BHC (212J) is £280.
. The support bracket which bolts onto the front of the cyl block is also different. It appears to pick up on different tappings so you would need to check if the AMF engine has the same tappings. This new bracket is approx £70

Cheers Spike
 
Fantastic, thank you Spike.
Considering the existing mounts have lasted for 10 years and the 'upgrade' to the ATL/BHC mounts is twice the price, I think I'll keep life simple and just do a direct replacement.
Thanks very much for clearing this up.

Cheers,

Tom
 
hotstuff said:
Does that mean I was correct Tom?

Tony
Click to expand...

We'll find out when Awesome change the mounts, I suppose! :p

I'm fairly convinced by your analysis of the problem. I had a good look at the mounts yesterday and there's a rubbery powder forming on top of the gearbox, near the selector lever, which leads me to believe that the mount is disintegrating. The off-side mount is similarly flaky. Also, the engine shakes increasingly when I first start it.
Furthermore, excessive movement of the engine when accelerating/engine braking could stress the exhaust, and you noticed a slight exhaust problem when driving my car.

I'll keep you posted!

Tom

PS: Did Jeff talk to you on Friday about the PM I sent him?
 
Hi folks,

Another engine mount related question...

Could somebody please tell me whether any of the bolts on either of the engine mounts are of the stretch variety? Can I reuse the existing bolts or do I need to buy new ones?

Thanks,

Tom
 
Hi Tom

Stretch type bolts are normally only used in areas where tension is required - typically cylinder head bolts.
You can safely re-use the existing mounting bolts, I would suggest however to inspect them for corossion and replace them if need be.
To ensure a solid lock, you could use threadlock such as Locktite.

blue skies
tony
 
Fantastic, thanks Tony. I've got the mounts in front of me, which Awesome will be changing next Tuesday. I'll keep you posted! :)

Tom
 
timmus said:
Hi folks,

Another engine mount related question...

Could somebody please tell me whether any of the bolts on either of the engine mounts are of the stretch variety? Can I reuse the existing bolts or do I need to buy new ones?

Thanks,

Tom
Click to expand...

Surprisingly all the bolts on the front mounts are 'torque plus angle' and according to Audi, should be replaced.
I removed the front mount while changing the cambelt and re-used the old bolts with no ill effect. I even re checked they had not slackened after a couple of weeks and all were ok. I think its just easier for Audi to specify replacement even though less critical fasteners can usually be re-used 2 or 3 times ( not so for con rod, main bearing and head bolts as hotstuff also indicated)
I think some of the mount bolts screw into alloy and I'm not keen on using Loctite in these cases as in my opinion it increases the risk of thread damage next time they are removed.

Cheers Spike
 
Thanks for the extra info, Spike. I'll let Awesome know to give the bolts a good inspection and not to use Loctite when putting them back. I'll also be sure to keep an eye on them in the months after the replacement. I'm really hoping this solves the knocking knoise I've getting on/off power.

Cheers,

Tom
 
Hi Tom

Awesome must have done loads of cambelts which require removal of the front mount so they will know how to handle the engine mount bolts. Still no harm in asking what they recommend though.

Cheers Spike
 
Just a quicky ...

Milton Keynes Audi replaced the cambelts on both our cars, TDi & FSi and in both cases did not replace any bolts - of course, I cannot be sure that they even removed the mountings! As for the threadlock, I agree with Spike as to possible damage to threads - there are locking compounds that resist vibration rather than forming a solid chemical locking bond and that are friendly to softer metals.

blue skies (i wish)
tony
 
hi folks, im not to sure how to post so had to do it this way. I bought an a2se petrol 1.4 on a 01 plate I just loved the look of it once i saw it,My problem is i think i have been bumped,it has 66000on the clock but once i found out how to get the bonnet off i noticed something unusual the engine seems to be slightly leaning down on the right hand side:0 as you look at it..is this normal,also the valves are a bit tappity which is making me think this may be a replace ment engine,the guy who sold it to me never mentiond anything regarding this,is there anyway i can check? can any1 help pls?
 
New Mounts

Well folks, I've had my engine mounts and torque arm replaced.
After 149,000 miles, the previous ones were getting a little worn. Having had them renewed, things generally feel much tighter. The car judders less when accelerating from stand-still and I get much less steering wheel judder in particular.
The engine also doesn't feel like it's about to fall out when I start it from cold.

The replacement torque arm has also tightened things up nicely when accelerating / engine braking.

You can see some photos of the mounts below. These are for the AMF engine.

Cheers,

Tom
 

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In a first step to lessen the 'bucking' transmission play that I have encountered since buying my A2 SE TDi 75 I have today fitted a new 'dog bone' torque arm with new bolts as stated in the Haynes Polo manual. I was hoping to find arm with a completely broken up rubber bush in the larger end of the dog bone that is sandwiched in the subframe plates. It was detached on both sides of the 'diamond' but looked better than I imagined. Dog Bone Torque Bar cost approx £140. Bolts, four in total £4.65.

However it has made a considerable contribution to the smoothness of changing gear over the 15 miles we drove it even though I was driving it carefully as I have learnt to do since owning the car. I'll drive it more agressively and in the traffic of the town to see how it performs on and off power. I think new bolts are a must especially when applying the 90 degree bolt tightening sequence into the alloy thread of the diff casing.The feeling of the bolt stretching is similar to the feeling of a thread stripping which it may well be if you reuse already stretched bolts!

My rear SPIDAN 49546's arrived well packed from PRINZ-Autoteile.de on Friday. First Class service and a delight to deal with. Highly recommended following my disappointment and refund from 123carspares. I was not aware that there are two grades of rear spring seat for the A2? Which is the one to go for?

Took advantage of the Eurocarparts offer on Pagid front discs at £41 a pair inc free carriage...arrived next day too.
 
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