Looking for 1.2tdi abroad

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Fully agree with @gills , a very good and valuable write-up ? ?

Admin/Moderators - is it legal to wish for a separate sub-forum for 1.2TDI ? (as the German forum has) or has this topic been discussed and closed? or could the "search string" been rewritten so one could search for "ANY" ?

It is to my opinion sad in a way, that very valuable write-ups and all the technical brilliant info like what @RAB share (as one example) to often "disappear" below thread headings that are not very descriptive.... and that is sad.

(as probably noted; i'm a bit frustrated today... winter is here, my rented garage is not for hire after new year, I have a lot of job to do and no indoor place to be, my dear 1.2TDI was next up....)

I hope it is ok to "think a little loud"

cheers
dieselfan
 
Thanks for replies. The 1.2 tdi automatics that I have been looking at seem to be 4 seaters with aircon etc(fully loaded as they used to say). I can only assume that the model evolved and does not always have the weight saving features that it may have initially had, which is a good thing in terms of compatibility.
My main concern is the bother of the purchase itself.
 
I think if I was to analyse wanting to buy the 1.2 a2 it would not be for the reason of economics for the two reasons I’m going to mention left-hand drive different running components gearbox etc and the ease of how to obtain these long-term let alone who could repair locally ..
But that’s not to say I haven’t always fancied one of course a lot us would .. It’s just with my practical head and 1.4 TDI being so economical already the same overall car and ease of getting spares sometime thanks to the likes of Steve with a secondhand parts I might add ..I don't now see the point... unless of course you have a passion to own one that’s a different matter ..when you don’t look at the practical aspect of ownership it’s ok ..and for the esteem of owning that particular model yes of course I can see it ...
 
No, it didn't evolve - there were always two versions. The full 3L version is no power steering, no aircon and a few other things... but the version with those things is still a 3.3l car. Remember here that the l/100km scale is linear, unlike mpg, so 3.3l really is 10% more fuel than 3l/100.
Having said that, minor changes to a 75 can get you pretty darned close to 4l/100...

I don't agree with the 1.2 thing in the UK forum. The amount of posts is too small - there are less than 10 1.2s in the UK and I remember it being less than 5. The traffic comes here because it's English language, not for the wide breadth of competence. For multiple users who know and refurb with skill and knowledge and experience, that's the place to go. But the language barrier is seen as high. People like Andre (phoenix), Mankmil, Mark (derweissea2), Artur and Janihani (with the manual conversion of a 1.2) .... there is a lot of competence over there.

And as far as compatibility goes: aircon doesn't change it. The wishbones are always aluminium and the console is different, as is the rear brake setup. It is a very specific car with very specific needs. Your hassle to get parts if no-deal goes ahead is about to get a lot more difficult, because of the paperwork. If you are going to do it, you should do it before Brexit and that's hard with Lockdowns in place across most of Europe right now.

- Bret
 
No, it didn't evolve - there were always two versions. The full 3L version is no power steering, no aircon and a few other things... but the version with those things is still a 3.3l car. Remember here that the l/100km scale is linear, unlike mpg, so 3.3l really is 10% more fuel than 3l/100.
Having said that, minor changes to a 75 can get you pretty darned close to 4l/100...

I don't agree with the 1.2 thing in the UK forum. The amount of posts is too small - there are less than 10 1.2s in the UK and I remember it being less than 5. The traffic comes here because it's English language, not for the wide breadth of competence. For multiple users who know and refurb with skill and knowledge and experience, that's the place to go. But the language barrier is seen as high. People like Andre (phoenix), Mankmil, Mark (derweissea2), Artur and Janihani (with the manual conversion of a 1.2) .... there is a lot of competence over there.

And as far as compatibility goes: aircon doesn't change it. The wishbones are always aluminium and the console is different, as is the rear brake setup. It is a very specific car with very specific needs. Your hassle to get parts if no-deal goes ahead is about to get a lot more difficult, because of the paperwork. If you are going to do it, you should do it before Brexit and that's hard with Lockdowns in place across most of Europe right now.

- Bret
Thanks for your reply. It is good to know that there were two sorts of 1.2 tdi. The minor differences do not bother me as primarily I wanted an automatic. With a different gearbox and engine, I would have expected the console to be different, but it is not really a part that wears out. The other bits are serviceable and available.
The cheaper ones have unreliable gearboxes. Is this something that can be managed with careful driving?
 
The cheaper ones have unreliable gearboxes. Is this something that can be managed with careful driving?
In a word, no. It won't be the actual gearbox that's likely to be unreliable but the associated (external) hydraulics. If that's not working pretty well 100%, you won't even be able to start the engine. The hydraulics can be sorted but be prepared to pay much more than you did for the car. I wouldn't consider going to Europe to buy one now. With their age, it's just too risky.

RAB
 
As RAB said, the 'box faults come down to two issues:
- hydraulics
- the mechatronics to manipulate the hydraulics.

The hydraulics themselves - like the main pressure container - will deteriorate over time. The pump should start when the driver's door is opened and shouldn't need to run again for x number of gearchanges. The seals deteriorate and will need replacing at some point.
The bigger issue is the mechatronics. There are many sensors, switches and pots involved to tell the system where it is, what it is currently doing and to understand what it should be doing. These are reset at each GGE. Wear is the issue - and then the sensors not telling the wear correctly. There are hall sensors (magnets), touch sensors and potentiometers involved and each will be getting more unreliable as time goes on. The Führungshülse is another small part - €3, I believe - that requires a significant stripdown and rebuild to fit. Try starting a 1,2 with a faulty brake switch - that's not happening. Or where the gear lever does not report its position accurately, or where there's a small leak in the hydraulic system, or where the rear brake shoes are badly adjusted. These are all frequent reports back because these parts or systems are either unique to the 3l cars, the 1,2, the A2 or all of the above. There were 6000 of these built, ever. This car is not common and the expertise either needs to be there or it will be built on someone's time - and if it's not yours, you are likely to be paying for the privilege.

It's not like a W12 A8, where there's car which was expensive when new with expensive running costs to go with it that's now older and cheaper; it's a car that was complex when new and therefore expensive when it goes wrong now that's it's old and cheap.

- Bret
 
Thanks for replies. The 1.2 tdi automatics that I have been looking at seem to be 4 seaters with aircon etc(fully loaded as they used to say). I can only assume that the model evolved and does not always have the weight saving features that it may have initially had, which is a good thing in terms of compatibility.
My main concern is the bother of the purchase itself.
 
Hi Rod, Just buy one and drive home. Insure with Aviva or similar (check before you go and agree in principle) who have probably covered other UK run imports like ecoangel and me,
Now the time consuming, frustrating and expensive bit. Apply for UK registration having met current regs for UK homolgation. These will require mph speedo, right hand drive headlamps, UK spec rear fog lamps and reversing lights plus other minor issues. As it’s a used car, I expect it will need a full MoT at some point in this process. So, a bit of time and effort plus cost of conversion, MoT, Homologation Papers and charges for UK initial DVLA registration. DVLA website should provide links to whatever you need to do and costs of the paper haze process - not the Veblen parts needed or cost of fitting.I suspect the total will now be more than £500, but hopefully well under £1000..
Good luck with your search. Erling
 
As RAB said, the 'box faults come down to two issues:
- hydraulics
- the mechatronics to manipulate the hydraulics.

The hydraulics themselves - like the main pressure container - will deteriorate over time. The pump should start when the driver's door is opened and shouldn't need to run again for x number of gearchanges. The seals deteriorate and will need replacing at some point.
The bigger issue is the mechatronics. There are many sensors, switches and pots involved to tell the system where it is, what it is currently doing and to understand what it should be doing. These are reset at each GGE. Wear is the issue - and then the sensors not telling the wear correctly. There are hall sensors (magnets), touch sensors and potentiometers involved and each will be getting more unreliable as time goes on. The Führungshülse is another small part - €3, I believe - that requires a significant stripdown and rebuild to fit. Try starting a 1,2 with a faulty brake switch - that's not happening. Or where the gear lever does not report its position accurately, or where there's a small leak in the hydraulic system, or where the rear brake shoes are badly adjusted. These are all frequent reports back because these parts or systems are either unique to the 3l cars, the 1,2, the A2 or all of the above. There were 6000 of these built, ever. This car is not common and the expertise either needs to be there or it will be built on someone's time - and if it's not yours, you are likely to be paying for the privilege.

It's not like a W12 A8, where there's car which was expensive when new with expensive running costs to go with it that's now older and cheaper; it's a car that was complex when new and therefore expensive when it goes wrong now that's it's old and cheap.

- Bret
Hi Bret,
Your expanded reply on hydraulic and control system input signal issues is bang on - when there’s a gearbox change/clutch problem it needs a lot of thought (or embedded knowledge) to diagnose correctly and promptly resolve. I’d completely forgotten to mention that I’d had a whole load of grief early on due to Audi dealer incompetence. Didn’t recalibrate clutch properly after service, then got in a terrible muddle blaming progressively every hydraulic component within the system. I had full extended Audi warranty so simply gave them hassle over time taken - daily! I do however, as a direct result, now have a legacy stock selection of new and/or used gear and clutch related hydraulic actuators, main hydraulic pump, accumulators, sensors and pipes.. All sat waiting for another opportunity to be part of my A2. All parts unused, except one of the new gearshift Accumulators which was fitted at around 210,000 miles on a purely precautionary basis. It restored the 6 gear change performance baseline check that had gradually drifted down to a 3 change over the previous 50,000 miles.
There’s an excellent Audi training package for the A2 tiptronic type automated manual gearbox and all it’s hydraulics and control system senor logic, normal operation and fault finding. It’s a really good package for your local garage. They can refer to, if in doubt or when not having access to the owner......
As you say Bret, gearbox and clutch operating system isn’t simple and can be a car killer if ‘repair by replacement’ approach is not underpinned by knowledgeable faultfinding.
Keep safe, healthy, happy and remember to have some A2 fun!!
Erling #5N007503
 
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