Rear springs

Disco Stu

Disco Stu

Member
Hi all,
I'm wondering what the difference is between the standard springs and the Spidan 49546 (the car is currently sitting on these). I need to replace a broken spring (I will be replacing both) and I'm wondering what the difference is between the Spidan's and the 'standard' versions.
The parts catalogue lists about a dozen different types but most of the aftermarket companies (non Audi) I have enquired with only seem to differentiate between non-OSS and OSS.
The car is a 2002 1.4tdi Sport
Cheers in advance!
 
The original springs fitted to your A2 are listed on the stickers in the service booklet and the boot and are supposedly matched to the final production weight of your specific car. You can give Audi your registration number, and ask them to quote you for replacement springs, although these are likely to be quite expensive.

Have you been unhappy with those Spidan springs?
 
steve_c said:
The original springs fitted to your A2 are listed on the stickers in the service booklet and the boot and are supposedly matched to the final production weight of your specific car.
Click to expand...
That's good to know, thank you!

steve_c said:
Have you been unhappy with those Spidan springs?
Click to expand...
Not at all, they've been fine and were fitted when we bought the car, just one of them has broken and it seems quite troublesome getting hold of the same ones
 
Disco Stu said:
Not at all, they've been fine and were fitted when we bought the car, just one of them has broken and it seems quite troublesome getting hold of the same ones
Click to expand...

It's probably more sensible to ask for suggestions for suitable alternatives, pretty much all of which come in substantially cheaper than the Audis.
 
steve_c said:
So you're looking for a close equivalent to the Spidan springs? @Robin_Cox might be able to assist, as he has done a fair bit of research into springs.
Click to expand...
I'm indecisive over it all, I can't seem to see what the benefits of the Spidans are over 'standard' spring. I was originally under the impression that the Sport had a different spring to the non-sport versions, but I can't find any evidence to support this (I can see that the spacers are narrower)
 
Disco Stu said:
I'm indecisive over it all, I can't seem to see what the benefits of the Spidans are over 'standard' spring. I was originally under the impression that the Sport had a different spring to the non-sport versions, but I can't find any evidence to support this (I can see that the spacers are narrower)
Click to expand...
Are your shock absorbers still original?
 
The aftermarket springs survey I did just over a year ago contains your Spidan 49546 - there are 3 other models from other common aftermarket suppliers that appear to have exactly the same measurements corresponding to Audi spring model 8Z0511115AS / BA .

I have a feeling now with the benefit of a bit more experience and hindsight that Sport model rear springs normally are around 305-308mm high (Audi models 8Z0511115R / AM ) and with thicker wire giving an approximate spring rate of 260-270 arbitrary units, whereas these appear to be standard height.
Apologies for editing in following table - it is losing the columns.

H - Height D - external diameter of coil - Th - wire thickness (all mm) ; rate calculation based on spring equation
Aftermarket model - car version - H D Th ~rate rate/height
Suplex 03172 AS all models (unclear if sport) 338 107 9.75 198.02 58.58
Spidan 49546 AS all models, no OSS 338 107 9.75 198.02 58.58
Sachs 996648 AS no OSS 338 107 9.75 198.02 58.58
TRW JCS782 AS all models (unclear if sport) 338 107 9.75 198.02 58.58

Hope this is of some use. Best, Robin

P.S - As an FYI I used Suplex springs on the front of our 1.4i based on the comprehensive survey I did of the whole range of aftermarket springs, and along with Bilstein B4s they were brilliant - very fine-riding and steering if not as chunky as the spring / shock combo on my Tdis. Conversely, I just used Bilstein B3 springs on the rear of my latest project car (I don't have measurements for these but they were from Spring-Loaded specifically for A2) and again they turned out just fine.
 
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Robin_Cox said:
Suplex 03172 AS all models (unclear if sport) 338 107 9.75
Spidan 49546 AS all models, no OSS 338 107 9.75
Sachs 996648 AS no OSS 338 107 9.75
TRW JCS782 AS all models (unclear if sport) 338 107 9.75
Click to expand...

There's a listing for the Sachs 996648 rear springs to replace 8Z0 511 115 AS on ebay.co.uk

www.ebay.co.uk

2x Sachs 996648 Rear Suspension Coil Springs AUDI A2 1.4/1.4D/1.6 | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 2x Sachs 996648 Rear Suspension Coil Springs AUDI A2 1.4/1.4D/1.6 at the best online prices at eBay! Free delivery for many products!
www.ebay.co.uk

There's also a listing for the Sachs 997854 front springs to replace 8Z0 411 105 AL on ebay.co.uk. These would be suitable for the 1.4 TDI without panaroma sunroof. Apparently, the front coil springs for the 1.4 TDI with panaroma sunroof have a different part number.

www.ebay.co.uk

2x Sachs 997854 Front Suspension Coil Springs AUDI A2 1.4D/1.6 | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 2x Sachs 997854 Front Suspension Coil Springs AUDI A2 1.4D/1.6 at the best online prices at eBay! Free delivery for many products!
www.ebay.co.uk

Also check out the gknautomotive.com online catalogue for Spidan coil springs with matching OEM part numbers. This is a useful catalogue as it gives the specification of each spring such as length, outside diameter, wire thickness, and weight. You can also use the OEM part number to search for the Spidan version.

autodoc.co.uk is another useful website where you can find the part numbers for the Suplex, Spidan, Sachs, and TRW coil springs. I have used autodoc.co.uk once for springs, but the box had already been opened and inside was the wrong spring...so I wouldn't recommend them. Probably best to stick to ebay and even then only from a reputable seller.

Spidan only list two rear springs for the Audi A2, standard and reinforced which makes choosing replacement rear springs easy. Just go for the standard version unless you tow a caravan or have another reason for an extra hard spring. Spidan list about four front springs for the Audi A2, as each spring is closely matched to the weight of the engine and sometimes varies if you've got a panaroma sunroof.

Often with aftermarket springs, manufacturers adopt a one size fits all approach. This is where you see one aftermarket spring being sold to replace multiple OEM numbers where these OEM numbers have different specifications, eg. different compression rates and different lengths, etc. This is where it's best to find an aftermarket spring that only matches the OEM part number that you want and no other part numbers. It seems that where multiple OEM part numbers with different specifications are used, then the aftermarket part will tend to match the hardest spring in that selection. This is where you could end up with a harder spring than intended. I recently came across such underhand marketing with Lesjofors/Kilen springs (same company). Lesjofors/Kilen don't mark the part number on the spring, except for some unintelligible manufacturer's code. This means that you've no way of checking whether the spring inside the box is what you ordered. Lesjofors/Kilen don't even give the specification of the spring such as length, outside diameter, wire thickness, weight. I would not recommend Lesjofors/Kilen springs for these reasons.
 
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I've been lucky with the springs & shocks combinations that I have used thus far - the above spring rate calculation is based on the right equation with an assumption on coil numbers, but depends absolutely on Autodoc and a few Ebay sellers having the right data that I mined for the tables, because otherwise "garbage in garbage out". It's an indication but still a bit of a shot in the dark. That being said, it worked brilliantly for the front Suplex springs on our 1.4i and I hope would work for other folk as well but no guarantee for the above reasons.

Current set ups -
04 Tdi SE - Monroe SP3248 front + Bilstein B4, original rear springs with paint marks still visible, original rear shocks. 195/55/16 all round. Ride is good but firm, no significant lean in twisty bits. Decent on back roads, but also good for long spells on the motorway (Dundee to Plymouth return several times annually).

52 1.4i SE. Suplex 03207 front + Bilstein B4, original rear springs + Sachs shocks. 185/50/16 all round. Ride is supple / much lighter feeling steering than the 04 Tdi - good on bad roads. Used exclusively for commuting.

02 Tdi+OSS SE. Original front springs from 04 car+Bilstein B4, Bilstein B3+Bilstein B4 rears. 195/45/16 all round. Ride feels similar to 1.4i, considerably lighter tyres than 04 Tdi lead to steering feeling much more agile. Used more or less exclusively for commuting.
 
Robin_Cox said:
Current set ups -

52 1.4i SE. Suplex 03207 front
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According to an ebay seller the Suplex 03207 replaces OEM part number 8Z0 411 105 AJ and the specification he gives is length 337mm, thickness 11mm, outer diameter 138mm, weight 1.51kg

www.ebay.co.uk

Suplex Coil Spring, Front Axle, OE Quality, 03207 | eBay

Fitting Position: Front Axle. Cross Reference Numbers Picture is an accurate example, Actual item may vary slightly. We are always help you to have a 100% positive happy buying experience. Thickness: 11mm.
www.ebay.co.uk

The ebay seller also lists Suplex 03171 to replace OEM part number 8Z0 411 105 AM and the specification he gives is length 342mm, thickness 11.25mm, outer diameter 139mm, weight 1.55kg

www.ebay.co.uk

Suplex Coil Spring, Front Axle, OE Quality, 03171 | eBay

Fitting Position: Front Axle. Cross Reference Numbers Picture is an accurate example, Actual item may vary slightly. We are always help you to have a 100% positive happy buying experience. Thickness: 11.25mm.
www.ebay.co.uk

From what I can gather on the gknautomotive.com online catalogue, 8Z0 411 105 AJ is for the 1.4 petrol with panarama sunroof whereas the 8Z0 411 105 AM is for the 1.4 petrol without panarama sunroof. So it would appear that the 1.4 petrol with panarama sunroof uses a lighter duty spring than the 1.4 petrol without panarama sunroof. Maybe people with panarama sunroofs like to have a softer ride?
 
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No. It has to do with the weight addition and its distribution and the follow-on requirements for ride and roll.
Personally, I would not go any bouncier than the B3.

As far as the lighter steering is concerned, remember the additional nose weight of the TDI vs Petrol. I believe the axle weight is of the order of 50kg different, I don't remember the precise details but would expect it to have a significant impact. The TDI is nearly 70/30 IIRC.

- Bret
 
@carlston

It is very easy to quote measurements and speculate based on what the suppliers suggest - I did this a lot last year. I should stress though that the result of my analysis highlighted that there are occasional questionmarks regarding the recommendations for specific models (ie petrol vs diesel, non OSS vs OSS, sport vs non-sport, 1.2tdi vs heavier models as an approximate calculation of spring rate coefficients). The discrepancies for aftermarket springs linked to above model variants vary widely and don't always make sense but that could be accounted for if their "turns" factor varied from 5.5 as this is not a detail quoted on any of the Autodoc, Ebay or major manufacturer websites yet something that contributes hugely to spring rates). From a scientific perspective though, the only cast-iron outcome it to actually install the part and see what happens. Irrespective of whether the codes identified by the gkn catalogue as matching the Suplex 03207 or 03171 are deemed better for OSS or non-OSS car, on ours (1.4i, non OSS) I have 03207 springs with B4 shocks, and it has turned out to be an excellent setup on this vehicle with 16" SE wheels and 185/50/16 budget tyres all round that don't weigh much. No more no less.
 
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Well today I have managed to change the rear springs - fitted the Suplex ones purely and simply due to the fact that the local factors had them on the shelf and it meant minimum time that the car would be off the road.
Old spring looked like:
CCD107E1-CCC2-4223-A3DC-6C8802F0F206.jpeg


The lower shock absorber bolt seemed to be a ‘screw’ rather than a bolt, I would have thought that it would be a bolt and not be threaded all the way along?
4E013542-BE63-4819-8C35-410740F2698C.jpeg
 
Disco Stu said:
Well today I have managed to change the rear springs - fitted the Suplex ones purely and simply due to the fact that the local factors had them on the shelf and it meant minimum time that the car would be off the road.
Old spring looked like:
View attachment 59889


The lower shock absorber bolt seemed to be a ‘screw’ rather than a bolt, I would have thought that it would be a bolt and not be threaded all the way along?
View attachment 59888
Click to expand...
I came across the same fully threaded rear bottom absorber bolt on mine. I agree it did not seem right for the shock to rest on a thread. Indeed 7zap shows a partial threaded bolt with 45mm of thread, item 8 in ...

suspension; shock absorbers Audi A2 (A2) 2003 year Audi EUROPA 511010

suspension<br/>shock absorbers Audi A2 (A2) 2003 year Audi EUROPA 511010 spare parts
audi.7zap.com audi.7zap.com

The fun starts trying to buy two, seem expensive and not many sources, one eBay seller wants £15 each!, Audi or TPS will probably be a better bet. If you google the part number some sellers quote the fully threaded bolt as an alternative, no doubt cheaper which is why it has been used.

The manual specifies replace both nut and bolt, personally I would reuse the correct bolt (after all the working force is perpendicular), but I would replace the single use self-locking nut.

Andy
 
I bought two sets of the full bolt kit front and back suspension overhaul from check republic Skoda ..£40 per set and that’s everything inc post ..
It’s all same co vw Skoda audi ..we get ripped off big time in uk
 
Disco Stu said:
Well today I have managed to change the rear springs - fitted the Suplex ones purely and simply due to the fact that the local factors had them on the shelf and it meant minimum time that the car would be off the road.
Old spring looked like:
View attachment 59889



Fingers crossed that these prove to be replacements you were looking for. I'll probably need a rear spring set on my 04 Tdi at some point so will be interested to follow your experience with these.
Click to expand...
 
When I did the rear suspension on the project car I got this combination bolt set (2 of these, including bottom bolt / nut & 2x top bolts) - I did also replace the top mounts, springs (B3), shocks (B4), shock protectors & bump-stops, spring top and bottom mounts (all Febi).

www.ebay.co.uk

Genuine VW Rear Shock Top Mount Bolt Nut Kit M10x75 Golf Mk4 Polo Audi A1 A2 TT | eBay

1x N90517304 - M10x75 Hex Bolt (supersedes N90517302). For Golf mk4 and Polo Platform cars (inc Audi, Seat Skoda models based off this platform, see compatibility list below). Golf Mk4: 1998-2006. A2: 2000-2005.
www.ebay.co.uk
 
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