weight of A2

Clackers said:
Always makes me wonder how the F1 teams spend millions saving every nanogram on a vehicle, then allow the drivers to grow trendy face fur...surely they would be better asking them to be close shaven if not totally hairless like cyclists are!!!!I think the reason I have never been approached by racing team is because I like sausage butties too much...that's my reasoning anyway.
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I think Martin Brundle went the same way!
 
Will said:
This thread makes me think - I've read a lot of threads on aero mods, but very few if any on weight saving.
From my experience of other cars, unless you're willing to strip out the interior, removing rear seats etc, it's very expensive to save a few kg with carbon fibre parts or such like.
But nevertheless it would be a fun project to read to see how light someone could get a road legal A2. :)
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I once gave a talk on the A2 and as a group exercise ask the audience how they would take a diesel A2 with combined 78mpg and make it into a 100mpg (like the 3L model). I then showed how the A2 designers did it through weight reduction, drag reduction, power reduction and behaviour reduction. Here is the weight reduction slide:

Audi A2 U3A Talk v15 slide 52 2L Weight Reduction.jpg


The kg figures are the weight reductions where kown.
 
@Evripidis
In my case , the only car at home that are MoT OK, and have an engine, is my wife's so I probably use the word "please" much more often than you.... ;) and my kids helps me a lot with the maintenance of my A2's so I will keep them , despite the weight ....
 
Alan_uk said:
I once gave a talk on the A2 and as a group exercise ask the audience how they would take a diesel A2 with combined 78mpg and make it into a 100mpg (like the 3L model). I then showed how the A2 designers did it through weight reduction, drag reduction, power reduction and behaviour reduction. Here is the weight reduction slide:

View attachment 72984

The kg figures are the weight reductions where kown.
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Nice picture, thanks you.
But it could be interpreted as front disc are in aluminium, not sure that is correct. The wheels are often referred to as being magnesium, but actually is mainly aluminium. But still a very impressive engineering result, this car :).
 
Alan_uk said:
I once gave a talk on the A2 and as a group exercise ask the audience how they would take a diesel A2 with combined 78mpg and make it into a 100mpg (like the 3L model). I then showed how the A2 designers did it through weight reduction, drag reduction, power reduction and behaviour reduction. Here is the weight reduction slide:

View attachment 72984

The kg figures are the weight reductions where kown.
Click to expand...

Brilliant slide.
Do you. or others, know if the side reinforcement ,right and left console, item #2,3 and 4, was a part of the official weight reduction program...?

I do not have exact numbers but the difference in weight for these three parts on the 1.2TDI compared to 2005 1.4TDI BHC is "huge"


image_2020-11-13_203316.png
 
Joga said:
Nice picture, thanks you.
But it could be interpreted as front disc are in aluminium, not sure that is correct. The wheels are often referred to as being magnesium, but actually is mainly aluminium. But still a very impressive engineering result, this car :).
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@Joga
are you absolutely shore those rims are not made of AZ91, which we sold to VAG and Porsche for their prestige rims at that time.
AZ91 is 90% Mg and 9% Al and has a density of 1.81 compared to Al which is 2.7 ish it sounds weird to not use that potensial ....
By using Az91 instead of Al, let 30kg become 20kg.... sounds like a dream to me for a designer lead working to achieve "der 3L auto"

cheers
dieselfan
 
Alan_uk said:
Any idea Bret how that was achieved?
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I wasn't present. Some thinner parts, some parts excluded, I believe. EDIT says there are some comments somewhere on the German forum, it would be an effort to drag them out. I will have a think about some keywords for it.

The weight-paring was extreme.

- Bret
 
dieselfan said:
@Joga
are you absolutely shore those rims are not made of AZ91, which we sold to VAG and Porsche for their prestige rims at that time.
AZ91 is 90% Mg and 9% Al and has a density of 1.81 compared to Al which is 2.7 ish it sounds weird to not use that potensial ....
By using Az91 instead of Al, let 30kg become 20kg.... sounds like a dream to me for a designer lead working to achieve "der 3L auto"

cheers
dieselfan
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Well, I shall admit have not analyzed the material in a lab, so I dont have that confidence level. But I have read about it, and I managed to find this now:
https://wiki.a2-freun.de/wiki/index.php/Leichtmetallfelgen
Nevertheless they are lightweight. Both me and @SEA2Driver have noticed that a complete wheel (rim and tyre) can easily be lifted with just a horizontal finger!
 
Here's another example of VW/Audi saving weight. The Lupo 1.4FSi (5L/100km petrol version of the 3L with the first FSi engine) has titanium rear springs:

Worth the weight | The Engineer

The use of titanium suspension springs to save weight and improve performance reaches new heights on Ferrari’s Challenge Stradale. Jon Excell reports. At £134,000 the Ferrari Challenge Stradale, a street-legal racing car, may be out of most drivers’ price range – but it is technically the...
www.theengineer.co.uk www.theengineer.co.uk

The early 3L's were already too light at the rear, so certainly didn't need titanium rear springs. The early 3L's had two substantial lead weights in the rear bumper! That's why VW later moved the battery to the boot and changed the hatch door to steel rather than aluminium/magnesium construction. VW's story was that this change was due to corrosion! The post change 3L's still had one lead weight in the bumper!

RAB
 
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