I have just returned from Stealth Racing. They have done an incredible amount of work on my A2 75 BHP diesel! The work included 5th gear mod (0.681 ratio!), Koni FSD's, brakes, some bodywork and much more! All this in one day and for an incredibly reasonable cost! They, (Vince, Dave and John) are a really friendly and great bunch of fella's! There is an absolute wealth of knowledge to be had there. The level of competence is second-to-none and you are treated with respect and kindness! I drove back feeling like a King! The car purred along at reduced revs, but at 55-75 mph, it would pull strongly. Further, there was reasonable flexibility at lower speeds in 5th gear, from 45mph onwards.I can't wait for another visit! I'm highly recommending Stealth to you, A2OC Members!
Stealth Racing ..... GREAT!
- Thread starter DJ 190
- Start date
FIRSTLY, sorry, guys (Ratovan2, loudchris, dan-b) ! I just didn't realise that you had all responded .... I wasn't ignoring you .... far from it, I think of you as friends! Now, lets take things one-at-a-time!
Ratovan2 :- The 0.681 gear, speed gear and Syncro ring were all replaced. That lot came to £194.44, +VAT = £233.33! I was there from 9 A.M. to 6:20 P.M. Do you know what they did??!! :- Set Weitec springs, rear Bump stops, Inner anti-roll bar bushes, O/S Track Rod End, 4-Wheel alignement, 5th gear mod, repairs to wing side bracket (shattered), Stealth tuning > 86 BHP to 108BHP! Now, the labour cost? 4 hours at £45 per hour, = £180 !!! I kid you not ! People seem to be so very kind to me!
loudchris :- You are absolutely deluding yourself! (please, no offence intended!) You know that that 5th gear is more or less useless until you get up to at least 50 mph, I recon, with that 0.659 gear! You have lost a sensible cruising gear for general, mid-speed use, and instead have what is in effect, an overdrive gear! I think that even at 70 mph, I will have significantly more "grunt" and pulling power with my 0.681 ratio! Now, I can thoroughly recommend Stealth .... it really is money well spent! Oh, here's another bonus that you might not be aware of ..... you can have any further mapping/check for just £60 + VAT!
dan-b :- They isolate the EGR as part of the remap. They cannot fit a by-pass to my particular car type (it is too old?) There have been no problems whatsoever with smooth running. There is no "juddering" on pulling to a stop. It is 100% perfect! Now, Stealth's response to ANY problems that might occur is this :- If you don't tell them about it, then how can they put it right??!! Vince says that their work is fully guarenteed, and that they will sort out ANY problem, free-of-charge! You can't be fairer than that! They are a GREAT bunch of GUYS!
Well, that's it! Hope all that helps! You can always P.M. me for any other help that I can give!
Kind regards,
David
Ratovan2 :- The 0.681 gear, speed gear and Syncro ring were all replaced. That lot came to £194.44, +VAT = £233.33! I was there from 9 A.M. to 6:20 P.M. Do you know what they did??!! :- Set Weitec springs, rear Bump stops, Inner anti-roll bar bushes, O/S Track Rod End, 4-Wheel alignement, 5th gear mod, repairs to wing side bracket (shattered), Stealth tuning > 86 BHP to 108BHP! Now, the labour cost? 4 hours at £45 per hour, = £180 !!! I kid you not ! People seem to be so very kind to me!
loudchris :- You are absolutely deluding yourself! (please, no offence intended!) You know that that 5th gear is more or less useless until you get up to at least 50 mph, I recon, with that 0.659 gear! You have lost a sensible cruising gear for general, mid-speed use, and instead have what is in effect, an overdrive gear! I think that even at 70 mph, I will have significantly more "grunt" and pulling power with my 0.681 ratio! Now, I can thoroughly recommend Stealth .... it really is money well spent! Oh, here's another bonus that you might not be aware of ..... you can have any further mapping/check for just £60 + VAT!
dan-b :- They isolate the EGR as part of the remap. They cannot fit a by-pass to my particular car type (it is too old?) There have been no problems whatsoever with smooth running. There is no "juddering" on pulling to a stop. It is 100% perfect! Now, Stealth's response to ANY problems that might occur is this :- If you don't tell them about it, then how can they put it right??!! Vince says that their work is fully guarenteed, and that they will sort out ANY problem, free-of-charge! You can't be fairer than that! They are a GREAT bunch of GUYS!
Well, that's it! Hope all that helps! You can always P.M. me for any other help that I can give!
Kind regards,
David
john-wingnut
Active Member
All they have done is Mapped the EGR out, so the ECU doesn't use it. Basically like a bypass kit but nothing is added or taken away.
Also I dont know what your on about your car being too old for a bypass kit. All diesel A2's can have one fitted.......... BUT if so the earlier models suffer from the judder / shaking on shut down due to the removal of the butterfly, as on the later models the butterfly is separate to the EGR so this doesn't occur
John
Also I dont know what your on about your car being too old for a bypass kit. All diesel A2's can have one fitted.......... BUT if so the earlier models suffer from the judder / shaking on shut down due to the removal of the butterfly, as on the later models the butterfly is separate to the EGR so this doesn't occur
John
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john-wingnut
Active Member
Dan, mine was putting out 88 from stock. Vince said most of the 75's he has remapped came out in the 80's pre-mapping
John
John
timmus
A2OC Donor
I have been considering driving to Stealth for some time. I've been delaying because I'm still not quite sure what I want to have done (I have to prioritise my finances), but this thread is encouraging after a recent thread in which a member reported a few reservations about Stealth's work.
In defence of Chris, I must agree with his assessment of the 0.659 gear set. My TDI75 runs this ratio and isn't yet remapped, but the gear is perfectly useful above 40mph. Post-remap, I could believe Chris' claim that there's *just* enough torque to trundle along at 35mph, so long as you're not going up hill and don't require rapid throttle response.
The 'issue' with the 0.659 ratio is that there is a noticeable jump between 4th and 5th, as you'd expect. It's very much like having a 6th gear but no 5th. On winding A-roads, I'm sure I can't use my 5th as much as I might be able to had I chosen the 0.681 ratio. But I wouldn't be averaging just a whisker shy of 70mpg on motorway runs had I not chosen the ratio I did.
I'm looking forward to having the car remapped because that should close the gap (so to speak) between 4th and 5th. Ultimately, there is no right choice. We all look to customise our cars to our driving style, our use of the vehicle and our priorities. I understand why David's gone for the 0.681 ratio, but for me, that's not tall enough to merit the modification.
Cheers,
Tom
In defence of Chris, I must agree with his assessment of the 0.659 gear set. My TDI75 runs this ratio and isn't yet remapped, but the gear is perfectly useful above 40mph. Post-remap, I could believe Chris' claim that there's *just* enough torque to trundle along at 35mph, so long as you're not going up hill and don't require rapid throttle response.
The 'issue' with the 0.659 ratio is that there is a noticeable jump between 4th and 5th, as you'd expect. It's very much like having a 6th gear but no 5th. On winding A-roads, I'm sure I can't use my 5th as much as I might be able to had I chosen the 0.681 ratio. But I wouldn't be averaging just a whisker shy of 70mpg on motorway runs had I not chosen the ratio I did.
I'm looking forward to having the car remapped because that should close the gap (so to speak) between 4th and 5th. Ultimately, there is no right choice. We all look to customise our cars to our driving style, our use of the vehicle and our priorities. I understand why David's gone for the 0.681 ratio, but for me, that's not tall enough to merit the modification.
Cheers,
Tom
john-wingnut :- yes, what you say regarding later models, the butterfly is seperate to the EGR.... This WAS the issue with my 2001 A2 .... they do have bypass tubes, but couldn't fit one to my A2. I would like to modify and blank-off my EGR, as per details given on the A2OC However, as I have previously said, there are absolutely no issues with the car, post tuning .... it is a revelation how well it now drives ....power delivery is continuous and smooth! I know that it's going to return well over 60 mpg at the next fill-up, too!
timmus :- I am not going to be moved on this one... ha ha ! I am talking about the usefulness of that 5th. gear! I know that you could slow right down to a very low speed in 0.659 5th gear, but then what can you do? No, when you select almost any gear, and especially that 5th ratio, you KNOW from the feel of the engine wether it is useful and appropriate! Now it has been talked about that the 0.659 ratio will give slightly better economy at, say, 70 mph. BUT, consider this.... at 43 to 48 mph I am driving along already in my 0.681 5th gear .... I can smoothly accelerate and it is fully useable. You guys with a 0.659 ratio are still in 4th gear or have a "straining" engine, barely pulling 5th. Who is driving with the best economy now? Finally, when I'm driving at 70 mph, acceleration is strong and rapid! That is a good safety point! I also doubt that there is much difference in quietness between the two gears at 70 mph? I know that you can hardly now change that 0.659 ratio for another, but that's me .... I very carefully consider ALL aspects before I come to a decision. I DO think that I made the right choice ..... Sorry!
timmus :- I am not going to be moved on this one... ha ha ! I am talking about the usefulness of that 5th. gear! I know that you could slow right down to a very low speed in 0.659 5th gear, but then what can you do? No, when you select almost any gear, and especially that 5th ratio, you KNOW from the feel of the engine wether it is useful and appropriate! Now it has been talked about that the 0.659 ratio will give slightly better economy at, say, 70 mph. BUT, consider this.... at 43 to 48 mph I am driving along already in my 0.681 5th gear .... I can smoothly accelerate and it is fully useable. You guys with a 0.659 ratio are still in 4th gear or have a "straining" engine, barely pulling 5th. Who is driving with the best economy now? Finally, when I'm driving at 70 mph, acceleration is strong and rapid! That is a good safety point! I also doubt that there is much difference in quietness between the two gears at 70 mph? I know that you can hardly now change that 0.659 ratio for another, but that's me .... I very carefully consider ALL aspects before I come to a decision. I DO think that I made the right choice ..... Sorry!
john-wingnut
Active Member
They can fit a bypass tube to your diesel, as they have done to a no. of TDI 75's from this forum, including hotstuffs (which they messed up). Maybe they have changed there policy on fitting them to the combined butterfly EGR due to the shuddering???
timmus
A2OC Donor
This seems to imply that others don't carefully consider all aspects before making a decision. Remember, you are the only person who's chosen the 0.681 ratio.
I think the message of my previous post has been missed; there is no 'right' choice. If I lived out along the north coast of Wales, perhaps I'd have chosen the 0.681 ratio, too. From the nature of the roads around there, I can see that the 0.659 ratio would be a little too long to be consistently useful. I'm delighted that you're pleased with your choice. It clearly suits your driving style and your use of your car perfectly.
But, I do 90% of my miles on motorways. In the last few months, I've driven to Germany and back, to Oxford and back twice, to Aberdeen and back, to York and back, to Wester Ross and back twice, etc. Whilst I accept that on occasions when driving on local roads I am stuck in 4th because I cannot get the speed to merit the change up to 5th - hence limiting my economy - on average I am far, far better off with the 0.659 ratio because 90% of my miles are done in 5th. It was undeniably the right choice for me.
Mike Skipton also does a lot of motorway miles, but his car is powerful enough to drive the even longer cog set. I'd be a fool to argue that he'd not given his decision careful consideration.
Cheers,
Tom
Tom,
Have you seen my earlier posts? (I suppose there's one or two, now!!. Ha Ha!) This is what I said :-
Now, if most of one's driving consisted of regular motorway driving/commuting, then I can see that the even lower 0.659 ratio would have its benefits with lower revs at 70 mph and maybe slightly quieter, too.
So, I had thought of your driving style, Eh?
I still think that the 0.681 gear will still retain a higher proportion of "usefulness" in the general drivability of the car I'm talking about the mid-speed range! You are lucky in that you are almost always "up-there" in those higher speeds! BUT, even at, say, 70 mph, I recon that I have more "urge" if I have to accelerate up to 80 mph .... I feel that I'm there in fractions of a second! (that may be that Stealth work, though!) LOL!
Have you seen my earlier posts? (I suppose there's one or two, now!!. Ha Ha!) This is what I said :-
Now, if most of one's driving consisted of regular motorway driving/commuting, then I can see that the even lower 0.659 ratio would have its benefits with lower revs at 70 mph and maybe slightly quieter, too.
So, I had thought of your driving style, Eh?
I still think that the 0.681 gear will still retain a higher proportion of "usefulness" in the general drivability of the car I'm talking about the mid-speed range! You are lucky in that you are almost always "up-there" in those higher speeds! BUT, even at, say, 70 mph, I recon that I have more "urge" if I have to accelerate up to 80 mph .... I feel that I'm there in fractions of a second! (that may be that Stealth work, though!) LOL!
Skipton01
Admin Team
Don't forget David that you actually went to test Toms 0.659 gearset on that fateful day!! I seem to remember that you were delighted with the gear ratio and had you not had the accident that wrote your A2 off, I'd have had it fitted by now!
Also, the research I did into the ratios was very thorough - I carefully decided to recommend the 0.659 ratio as it is the perfect gear for 70mph motorway driving - you sit right on the point of turbo activation, meaning overtakes are a doddle. At 70mph, I am sitting at 2128rpm (VCDS checked). This correlates almost exactly with the theoretical numbers I generated in the original thread.
A 0.659 use will sit at 2241rpm, whereas you will be sitting at 2317rpm.
By 80mph, you'll be at 2670rpm, but 0.659 users will have more reserves of power, being sat at 2539rpm and I'll only just be over what you were doing at 70rpm, 2413rpm.
It's your call on the gearset you decided to install, but as I've always said, it is a very personal choice, based on driving style, journey type and so on. Don't be fooled into thinking that the 0.681 ratio is 'better' than the 0.659, as this is not the case, it's just different. For some people, who never venture outside the city limits, a standard box will be the best choice!
Cheers,
Mike
dan_b
A2OC Donor
So I'm on the A3 this morning in rush hour traffic moving along at 35mph - I'm in my 0.659 5th and cruising nicely, engine is just burbling to itself; traffic flow lightens up a bit and I accelerate in 5th up to 50mph keeping up with the BMW in front of me and the Mini to my inside with no effort or labour on the engine. How is this not a "useful" gear?
Last tank averaged 62mpg, my best on wide summer tyres.
Last tank averaged 62mpg, my best on wide summer tyres.
On my 0.681 gear, sub ~43mph, or so, just feels as though the engine is "straining"? It just feels as though you have selected that gear, a little too early? Now, if that is the case with the 0.681 gear, then how must it be for the 0.659 gear? Has anyone DRIVEN an A2 with that 0.681 gear fitted? No? Well, I have!..... my own! Look, as I have said, you are more than welcome to, at any time! There is a warm and friendly greeting here, for you all!
Now, Mike! OF COURSE you would have been fitting that gear for me ...... or ANY gear, for that matter! You are my number-one port of call, anytime! BUT, are other members fully aware of the ENORMOUS work load in your personal life! I have "priority" for you to help me with other outstanding work on my A2 ....you know that!. SO, for that 5th gear mod, I recon that I would have been looking at the year 2012 ..... and that would have been if I was lucky!.... You KNOW that you are the best! I have told you that the Champagne is in the fridge, ready for your visit to "Sunny", and definitely beautiful, North Wales!
Now, Mike! OF COURSE you would have been fitting that gear for me ...... or ANY gear, for that matter! You are my number-one port of call, anytime! BUT, are other members fully aware of the ENORMOUS work load in your personal life! I have "priority" for you to help me with other outstanding work on my A2 ....you know that!. SO, for that 5th gear mod, I recon that I would have been looking at the year 2012 ..... and that would have been if I was lucky!.... You KNOW that you are the best! I have told you that the Champagne is in the fridge, ready for your visit to "Sunny", and definitely beautiful, North Wales!
Skipton01
Admin Team
David, I was in no way passing comment on where you had your ratio fitted and as I am so incredibly busy with my tv work now, I don't have the time free any more to help members with their A2s - I barely have time to get on the forums these days (I'm actually in rehearsals for Footy Focus as I type).
You are incorrect though to assume that you'd have been waiting till 2012 for the 5th gear installation: I seem to remember it was 15th January when you came to me for cruise and were then going to try Timmus's 0.659 ratio. In all probability, you'd have had the ratio fitted by me before the end of January (we already had 28th Jan pencilled in, but as it turned out, we used that day to strip out your salvage).
I shall get around to visiting you in North Wales, as I have promised to, champagne is optional though, as I don't really drink (and certainly not when driving!).
Cheers,
Mike
You are incorrect though to assume that you'd have been waiting till 2012 for the 5th gear installation: I seem to remember it was 15th January when you came to me for cruise and were then going to try Timmus's 0.659 ratio. In all probability, you'd have had the ratio fitted by me before the end of January (we already had 28th Jan pencilled in, but as it turned out, we used that day to strip out your salvage).
I shall get around to visiting you in North Wales, as I have promised to, champagne is optional though, as I don't really drink (and certainly not when driving!).
Cheers,
Mike
timmus
A2OC Donor
Well, the rest of us with the 0.659 ratio (and, of those who have swapped their 5th gear, I believe that's all but 3 people in the UK) find it perfectly functional at significantly slower speeds than you're getting from your shorter ratio. So, if your engine in straining at 43mph, post remap, with a shorter ratio, I can only assume there's something amiss with your engine.
Anyway, this thread is leaning towards the surreal, so I'm off to research EGR options.
Cheers,
Tom